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Another kill job by the MeToo people. Probably because the NPC is an organization that has no obese or LGBT athletes and the judges are straight males.
JM Manion had a crappy site that no one ever subscribed to, probably because he shot the crappiest photos.
All these women went to the photoshoots willingly as a way to gain an unfair advantage over competition. What is the accusation exactly? 10-20 years later, shamelessly, they remembered that although they posed topless they didn't get the pro card in the mail or any real money.
If I was the Manions I would lawyer up and start suing, this is a kill job based on fabricated stories by the high priests of wokeism at WaPo.
Another kill job by the MeToo people. Probably because the NPC is an organization that has no obese or LGBT athletes and the judges are straight males.
JM Manion had a crappy site that no one ever subscribed to, probably because he shot the crappiest photos.
All these women went to the photoshoots willingly as a way to gain an unfair advantage over competition. What is the accusation exactly? 10-20 years later, shamelessly, they remembered that although they posed topless they didn't get the pro card in the mail or any real money.
If I was the Manions I would lawyer up and start suing, this is a kill job based on fabricated stories by the high priests of wokeism at WaPo.
Kill job…lol. Everybody knows this was going on
Another kill job by the MeToo people. Probably because the NPC is an organization that has no obese or LGBT athletes and the judges are straight males.
JM Manion had a crappy site that no one ever subscribed to, probably because he shot the crappiest photos.
All these women went to the photoshoots willingly as a way to gain an unfair advantage over competition. What is the accusation exactly? 10-20 years later, shamelessly, they remembered that although they posed topless they didn't get the pro card in the mail or any real money.
If I was the Manions I would lawyer up and start suing, this is a kill job based on fabricated stories by the high priests of wokeism at WaPo.
I had a legit spit-take at "the NPC is an organization that has no LGBT athletes"
It's hard to think of a single sport that has more bi-sexual, homosexual, and gay-for-pay athletes than male bodybuilding. Seriously, even figure skating can't compete. It's a good thing in my mind, but I always laugh at guys who look at bodybuilding as if this overblown beauty contest of waxed and pumped males posing in tiny bikinis for (mostly) other men is somehow super hetero and masculine. LOL.
And yes, the women's side has been rife with abuse and predatory criminals. As it is in any women's sport. I mean, if Olympic Gymnastics sat idly by while their doctor systematically violated pretty much every underage girl who was a member, do you think that the dudes (and it's all dudes) running female bodybuilding are these unbelievably stand-up gentleman who would never use their power and influence to compel sexual favors? Please.
And the inequality is easy to spot. Are professional male bodybuilders photographed this way and pressured to create sexual "content?" Does Nick Walker get shot wearing panties and massaging another man by the literal son of the organization's founder? No? Then why do it for the women?
I had a legit spit-take at "the NPC is an organization that has no LGBT athletes"
It's hard to think of a single sport that has more bi-sexual, homosexual, and gay-for-pay athletes than male bodybuilding. Seriously, even figure skating can't compete. It's a good thing in my mind, but I always laugh at guys who look at bodybuilding as if the overblown beauty contest of waxed and pumped males posing in tiny bikinis for (mostly) other men is somehow super hetero and masculine. LOL.
And yes, the women's side has been rife with abuse and predatory criminals. As it is in any women sport. I mean, if Olympic Gymnastics sat idly by while their doctor systematically violated pretty much every underage girl who was a member, do you think that do the dudes (and it's all dudes) running female bodybuilding are these unbelievably stand-up gentleman who would never use their power and influence to compel sexual favors? Please.
And the inequality is easy to spot. Are professional male bodybuilders photographed this way and pressured to create sexual "content?" Does Nick Walker get shot wearing panties and massaging another man by the literal son of the organization's founder? No? Then why do it for the women?
I was confused by the quote for a second until I realised I'd long since blocked the hilariously, hopelessly dumb individual who said that.
I have a feeling this thread will get nasty quickly so I will post this and never reply again.
I have no intention to defend the Manions but I am fully against cancel culture as promoted by WaPo.
NPC and the Manions have rumors circulating about them for years, I am certain there are politics going on as in every sport, State sanctioned ones, Olympic sports etc. Much much worse situations have plaqued other organization like the US Gymnastics team, or the Du Pont wrestler murderer or the ice skate scandal.
The Manions have been accused for favoritism but not rape or sexual assaults. Every sport that is subjectively judged will have this problem. Even Arnold was scandalous given the 1981 Olympia title. Iris Kyle lost an Olympia title because the judges were told to mark her down. Many Olympia titles were controversial and I am sure many athletes might have been made an example because they fell out of favor with the NPC. Just like the WWE athletes back in the 90s. NPC is a private company, just like Twitter when it cancels people that doesn't agree with.
Equalizing the US team doctor sexually assaulting minors with an NPC judge or promoter that asks for sexual favors from adults for placings at a show with no real prize money and with the option to avoid the show altogether is not exactly the same. Hundreds of men and women get pro cards every year and never meet the Manions.
Gays and lesbians sure they compete in the NPC but there is no celebration by the organization for their "uniqueness" or men competing as females or women as men. Arnold himself has posed for gay photos, many males do this for extra cash and females have OFans, sessions are a thing since the 80s etc. BBing is as much a beauty/sex pageant as a sport. Several insiders talked openly that a BB sexual marketplace exists since day one, however this is not sponsored by the organization.
And now for the WaPo video. What are the accusations? JM had too many photos of competitors, a guy named John Tuman (not Manion) pressed his body against a model in the presence of several other people, another one felt awkward, a pregnant athlete lost her contract, and the last one didn't like a 2 second video loop by a videographer (not JM) and regrets of talking favorably for JM Manion.
Did the photographer put a gun to their head to pose topless? Was there any sexual assault, any locked doors that prevent these women from running away? If anything else the Manions didn't give the pro cards to these women as a favor although they were willing to do something extra outside competition stage to get it. The first woman even accused the Olympians doing much more sexual favors than her and this is why they won. Would these women have had the same feelings if they got the pro card the next day or some royalties for the shitty photos that noone bought? Again and again you hear the reporter talking about men judging women unfairly, consent that it not really consent etc.
Funny thing, in the video, on the judging panel you can spot 2 women and 3 men. JM did try to make some money from media just like Herbiceps or Awefilms but he was such an incompetent photographer and businessman that he managed to fail even with the access he had to the best athletes. Many competitors pay the real photographers out of their own pocket and shoot much sexier content than JM ever shoot. If you ever saw what content he had at his site you would understand that if he had hired a professional to shoot the models he would have a business, happy clients and happy models.
WaPo might have some stronger cases to present in a future video, for the time being this is a shitty MeToo cancel culture attempt against the NPC.
A non-gated version has been posted on Yahoo (it's just missing the photos): https://www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/female-bodybu...
"Prestige" industries are ripe for corruption and exploitation. The Manions are shitheads. That said, it's easy to see how someone could misremember what happened, especially when it comes to regret.
James Franco offered young women about 100 bucks for full-frontal nudity. Good deal? Well, if the exposure leads to parts, which leads to fame and fortune. But the vast-vast majority will not come close. It's rich to pose naked for pictures with a commercial photographer and then be shocked -- shocked -- to learn nude pictures are circulating online.
I have a feeling this thread will get nasty quickly so I will post this and never reply again.
I have no intention to defend the Manions but I am fully against cancel culture as promoted by WaPo.
NPC and the Manions have rumors circulating about them for years, I am certain there are politics going on as in every sport, State sanctioned ones, Olympic sports etc. Much much worse situations have plaqued other organization like the US Gymnastics team, or the Du Pont wrestler murderer or the ice skate scandal.
The Manions have been accused for favoritism but not rape or sexual assaults. Every sport that is subjectively judged will have this problem. Even Arnold was scandalous given the 1981 Olympia title. Iris Kyle lost an Olympia title because the judges were told to mark her down. Many Olympia titles were controversial and I am sure many athletes might have been made an example because they fell out of favor with the NPC. Just like the WWE athletes back in the 90s. NPC is a private company, just like Twitter when it cancels people that doesn't agree with.
Equalizing the US team doctor sexually assaulting minors with an NPC judge or promoter that asks for sexual favors from adults for placings at a show with no real prize money and with the option to avoid the show altogether is not exactly the same. Hundreds of men and women get pro cards every year and never meet the Manions.
Gays and lesbians sure they compete in the NPC but there is no celebration by the organization for their "uniqueness" or men competing as females or women as men. Arnold himself has posed for gay photos, many males do this for extra cash and females have OFans, sessions are a thing since the 80s etc. BBing is as much a beauty/sex pageant as a sport. Several insiders talked openly that a BB sexual marketplace exists since day one, however this is not sponsored by the organization.
And now for the WaPo video. What are the accusations? JM had too many photos of competitors, a guy named John Tuman (not Manion) pressed his body against a model in the presence of several other people, another one felt awkward, a pregnant athlete lost her contract, and the last one didn't like a 2 second video loop by a videographer (not JM) and regrets of talking favorably for JM Manion.
Did the photographer put a gun to their head to pose topless? Was there any sexual assault, any locked doors that prevent these women from running away? If anything else the Manions didn't give the pro cards to these women as a favor although they were willing to do something extra outside competition stage to get it. The first woman even accused the Olympians doing much more sexual favors than her and this is why they won. Would these women have had the same feelings if they got the pro card the next day or some royalties for the shitty photos that noone bought? Again and again you hear the reporter talking about men judging women unfairly, consent that it not really consent etc.
Funny thing, in the video, on the judging panel you can spot 2 women and 3 men. JM did try to make some money from media just like Herbiceps or Awefilms but he was such an incompetent photographer and businessman that he managed to fail even with the access he had to the best athletes. Many competitors pay the real photographers out of their own pocket and shoot much sexier content than JM ever shoot. If you ever saw what content he had at his site you would understand that if he had hired a professional to shoot the models he would have a business, happy clients and happy models.
WaPo might have some stronger cases to present in a future video, for the time being this is a shitty MeToo cancel culture attempt against the NPC.
“Never reply again” is something you should really take to heart
I have a feeling this thread will get nasty quickly so I will post this and never reply again.
I have no intention to defend the Manions but I am fully against cancel culture as promoted by WaPo.
NPC and the Manions have rumors circulating about them for years, I am certain there are politics going on as in every sport, State sanctioned ones, Olympic sports etc. Much much worse situations have plaqued other organization like the US Gymnastics team, or the Du Pont wrestler murderer or the ice skate scandal.
The Manions have been accused for favoritism but not rape or sexual assaults. Every sport that is subjectively judged will have this problem. Even Arnold was scandalous given the 1981 Olympia title. Iris Kyle lost an Olympia title because the judges were told to mark her down. Many Olympia titles were controversial and I am sure many athletes might have been made an example because they fell out of favor with the NPC. Just like the WWE athletes back in the 90s. NPC is a private company, just like Twitter when it cancels people that doesn't agree with.
Equalizing the US team doctor sexually assaulting minors with an NPC judge or promoter that asks for sexual favors from adults for placings at a show with no real prize money and with the option to avoid the show altogether is not exactly the same. Hundreds of men and women get pro cards every year and never meet the Manions.
Gays and lesbians sure they compete in the NPC but there is no celebration by the organization for their "uniqueness" or men competing as females or women as men. Arnold himself has posed for gay photos, many males do this for extra cash and females have OFans, sessions are a thing since the 80s etc. BBing is as much a beauty/sex pageant as a sport. Several insiders talked openly that a BB sexual marketplace exists since day one, however this is not sponsored by the organization.
And now for the WaPo video. What are the accusations? JM had too many photos of competitors, a guy named John Tuman (not Manion) pressed his body against a model in the presence of several other people, another one felt awkward, a pregnant athlete lost her contract, and the last one didn't like a 2 second video loop by a videographer (not JM) and regrets of talking favorably for JM Manion.
Did the photographer put a gun to their head to pose topless? Was there any sexual assault, any locked doors that prevent these women from running away? If anything else the Manions didn't give the pro cards to these women as a favor although they were willing to do something extra outside competition stage to get it. The first woman even accused the Olympians doing much more sexual favors than her and this is why they won. Would these women have had the same feelings if they got the pro card the next day or some royalties for the shitty photos that noone bought? Again and again you hear the reporter talking about men judging women unfairly, consent that it not really consent etc.
Funny thing, in the video, on the judging panel you can spot 2 women and 3 men. JM did try to make some money from media just like Herbiceps or Awefilms but he was such an incompetent photographer and businessman that he managed to fail even with the access he had to the best athletes. Many competitors pay the real photographers out of their own pocket and shoot much sexier content than JM ever shoot. If you ever saw what content he had at his site you would understand that if he had hired a professional to shoot the models he would have a business, happy clients and happy models.
WaPo might have some stronger cases to present in a future video, for the time being this is a shitty MeToo cancel culture attempt against the NPC.
I agree with a some of what you said actually. I can't rock with idiotic terms like "cancel culture" "me too," and "woke," but it's true that there's not a huge amount of damning evidence there. The FBB models could have walked away from those photoshoots at any time. Doing them was a choice.
But let's not pretend that fit ripped women in tiny outfits doesn't have a strong sexual element. And one that can be easily exploited.
But if you talk to any bikini competitor or FBB, they'll tell you straight up that the competition industry is messed up for them. Beauty and looks are prioritized in a way that the men's side is not. Outside of this anecdote, you can imagine that all sorts of girls are pressured to do things that men are otherwise not. The gymnastics parallel wasn't comparing a rapist doctor with the a creepy photographer. They are absolutely not comparable. But more to point out that systematic victimization happens far more often in women's sports. The football coach from Penn State and his ilk would need to wake up early to molest as many male players at the gymnastics doctor did to those vulnerable and underage girls.
I'm good with the NPC. I don't want to see it "canceled." But I'm grateful that these stories are coming out. And hopefully, they'll make any potential predators think twice. I just want the women who we admire to be able to compete with dignity. And if they don't want to do sexy shoots or onlyfans or whatever... they should be able to win on simply the merit of the physique that they built.
Here's to J.M. for not even replying to WipePo's request for comment. I'm making this post now with great hesitation, because I don't think these types of baseless allegations by hack journalists are worthy of life.
I've been around the industry for more than 25 years. During that time, I've never heard a single whisper about J.M. with respect to sexual impropriety. Was I with him 24 hours a day? No, but if there had been anything, it probably would have leaked out over that time. Are there other judges and "power" trainers who have been discussed in that context? Yes. But J.M.? Never. His reputation is as a loving husband and father. Despite what the public gossipmongers want to believe, not every guy is going to put his family relationships at risk for a rendezvous with a hot little fitness model.
I don't know the current schedule, but for years, J.M. would travel all over the country what, 30-40 weekends a year, to cover NPC events. And at these shows, he would spend HOURS at the prejudging. It was exhausting just to THINK about sitting behind a camera that long, especially for the national shows. Hell, if a brotha had wanted to, he would've been too worn out to even think about it!! Seriously.
The YouTube video is weak. There are thousands of women (and some men) who are legitimate victims of sexual impropriety in a professional setting each year. This particular Washington Post exposé is a veritable insult to those who are really going through it.
Lastly, to the woman who stated "there can be no consent"...I don't even know what to say. But again, that's insulting to the women (and men) who have complete agency with their VOLUNTARY life choices.
Here's to J.M. for not even replying to WipePo's request for comment. I'm making this post now with great hesitation, because I don't think these types of baseless allegations by hack journalists are worthy of life.
I've been around the industry for more than 25 years. During that time, I've never heard a single whisper about J.M. with respect to sexual impropriety. Was I with him 24 hours a day? No, but if there had been anything, it probably would have leaked out over that time. Are there other judges and "power" trainers who have been discussed in that context? Yes. But J.M.? Never. His reputation is as a loving husband and father. Despite what the public gossipmongers want to believe, not every guy is going to put his family relationships at risk for a rendezvous with a hot little fitness model.
I don't know the current schedule, but for years, J.M. would travel all over the country what, 30-40 weekends a year, to cover NPC events. And at these shows, he would spend HOURS at the prejudging. It was exhausting just to THINK about sitting behind a camera that long, especially for the national shows. Hell, if a brotha had wanted to, he would've been too warn out to even think about it!! Seriously.
The YouTube video is weak. There are thousands of women (and some men) who are legitimate victims of sexual impropriety in a professional setting each year. This particular Washington Post exposé is a veritable insult to those who are really going through it.
Lastly, to the woman who stated "there can be no consent"...I don't even know what to say. But again, that's insulting to the women (and men) who have complete agency with their VOLUNTARY life choices.
Ok Jim
Ok Jim
😂 Another GWM classic - I literally put my name on the post. 🤷🏽♂️
I don’t understand the rush to co-sign with Washington Post’s laziness. The onus is never on a private citizen - or public figure, regardless of the size of that “public” - to prove their innocence when under attack by media. We all travel our own courses and set our own standards, but this sort of laziness never gets a free pass from me.
😂 Another GWM classic - I literally put my name on the post. 🤷🏽♂️
I don’t understand the rush to co-sign with Washington Post’s laziness. The onus is never on a private citizen - or public figure, regardless of the size of that “public” - to prove their innocence when under attack by media. We all travel our own courses and set our own standards, but this sort of laziness never gets a free pass from me.
Whatever one thinks of JM, to call an exhaustively researched investigative expose “lazy” displays a total lack of familiarity with the layers of editorial and legal review that’s invested in a Washington Post article of this scope. Dozens of interviews, transcripts, corroborations from contemporaneous witnesses-you better believe this is an airtight piece or it never sees the light of day.
A top-rated comment on WaPo's site:
The bodybuilding industry for either sex is nothing but a tarted-up version of a beauty pageant. The levels of exploitation, narcissism, and neurosis bundled into this activity are mind-boggling. Some body dysmorphia counseling is in order for all involved.
I guess all the people who are interested in the industry know that in and around industry all sorts of shit, but this shit has one peculiarity. All participants in the process, adults, mature people who have exactly found where to make money on a hobby that is not cheap and almost does not directly bring money. Where to get "drugs", the legality of which has always been under some question. And people know about what is possible, possibility is above zero, bodybuilding will literally kill them. I know and heard and read and they told me about everything, but a) there was never a word about compulsion. b) it has always been at the level of a dirty party for adults. Even the claims were always of the level "he did not pay me extra, but she was not nice enough, and I overpaid" and so on. And I have been watching everything from the outside for quite a long time, and I remember that somewhere once every few years there is an attempt to take away business out of the NPC. Feminists are often blamed for this, now MeToo, but I see this as an ordinary attempt to bring down the price and reputation and from tearing either a piece of the company or the whole of it.
Some body dysmorphia counseling is in order for all involved.
What about body positivity and body acceptance? Or can only be fat in this timeline?
Comment on WaPo's site:
I am curious about the website https://www.girlswithmuscle.com/images/ which I've been following since the early nineties which purports to post primary images of thousands of women in various stages of their fitness journey though it appears a relatively finite number of "users" actually are involved in posting these images. Where do they come from and who is producing and posting these image many of which then evolve to populate sites like Tumblr?
Can you imagine? Been following GWM since the early nineties! And he doesn't know where the photos come from!
Here is a brief comment/article from the lead journalist (Desmond Butler, son of George Butler of 'Pumping Iron' fame)
That was an interesting read. But also, while former Olympia promoter and IFBB vice-president Wayne DeMilia is a tremendous resource, he was ousted by the original organization he had helped to build into a household name. Anyone would still be a bit salty under those circumstances. For some, the whistleblower status = instant and incontrovertible credibility. But I think it's also fair to at least examine the other side of the story for context, if nothing else, eye of the beholder and all. I do like Wayne and consider him to be a person of integrity, but I also know that Wayne is all about the show. The man knows how to sell.
The WaPo just released an article (Paywalled) about the sexual exploitation raging in the industry.
As many will guess it, it mainly revolves around Manion's businesses. Have heard rumors regarding his 'practices' over 5 years at least.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/investigations...
For those who don't have access to the articles, there's a video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GVZvjyNlisw