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One thing I've always wondered is why it's seemingly so difficult to engineer a drug that targets the muscles without affecting hormone levels.
The body is very complicated, and medical science/technology has a long way to go. It's also complicated by the fact that you can't just do any experiment you want on humans. A lot of the knowledge of the precise effects of hypothermia for example come from Nazi experiments on prisoners/victims in concentration camps. That was 80 years ago and we still don't know much more because it's ethically forbidden territory.
No engineering is being done these days. The anabolic steroid technology has stopped back in the 80s. Big pharma stopped researching and producing new compounds. Politics, banning and the abuse from the sports community were the main reasons.
Any new developments had to do with the infamous Balco Labs, 20 years ago, that produced a couple of variants that were just a compromise to avoid detection in the WADA tests. SARMs is something really new but not superior or safer than regular anabolics. And they are already banned by WADA.
Contrary to what people believe usage in sports was pretty straight forward and really simple. Athletes would use one compound in some simple dosage scheme. The East Germans who were the top in that field pretty much used only Turinabol for the thousands of their athletes.
Bodybuilders are the true prolific users and abusers. Using crazy dosages, crazy combinations, stacking and never ending "cycles". I am surprised so few people are dying counting the fact that most of these compounds are black market with no safety regulation during production. What some women are doing to their body is mind boggling, in my book they have mental health problems.
Even if a safer PED was produced it would certainly be weak for use in BB and people would still use more and longer making it again unsafe. This is what happened to the older drugs that were meant as a safe temporary solution for sick people. People know what safe is but you can't win competitions.
No engineering is being done these days. The anabolic steroid technology has stopped back in the 80s. Big pharma stopped researching and producing new compounds. Politics, banning and the abuse from the sports community were the main reasons.
Any new developments had to do with the infamous Balco Labs, 20 years ago, that produced a couple of variants that were just a compromise to avoid detection in the WADA tests. SARMs is something really new but not superior or safer than regular anabolics. And they are already banned by WADA.
Contrary to what people believe usage in sports was pretty straight forward and really simple. Athletes would use one compound in some simple dosage scheme. The East Germans who were the top in that field pretty much used only Turinabol for the thousands of their athletes.
Bodybuilders are the true prolific users and abusers. Using crazy dosages, crazy combinations, stacking and never ending "cycles". I am surprised so few people are dying counting the fact that most of these compounds are black market with no safety regulation during production. What some women are doing to their body is mind boggling, in my book they have mental health problems.
Even if a safer PED was produced it would certainly be weak for use in BB and people would still use more and longer making again unsafe. This is what happened to the older drugs that were meant as a safe temporary solution for sick people. People know what safe is but you can't win competitions.
Remember that also all super hero movie stars are on ped, there is no way they can get massive in just 6 month with a good coach and diet. And if they were to take ped's that would be high quality. So i guess the average fbb can't afford the top of the line products while super stars can
Remember that also all super hero movie stars are on ped, there is no way they can get massive in just 6 month with a good coach and diet. And if they were to take ped's that would be high quality. So i guess the average fbb can't afford the top of the line products while super stars can
Almost all actors doing it are on short cycles of 8 weeks, medically supervised so most probably on testosterone only. Smokes and mirrors does the rest. Any BB would put them to shame if they stand next to them. Their PED usage is very light by BB standards.
The Rock or Arnold at his prime are obviously not on T only. Arnold was asked to downsize for his role in Conan. He was deemed too freakish.
Contrary to current belief, considerable research is being done to develop non-steroidal anabolic agents. There are a few universities and biotech companies working on this. The research is targeting the natural myostatin pathways. Myostatin is a natural muscle growth suppressant. However, direct inhibition of myostatin leads to other side effects, the pathway is complex. A current unmet medical need for these meds is muscle wasting or cachexia. Unfortunately, you most likely wouldn’t get supported if you requested funding for research to build muscle for aesthetic or athletic reasons.
Almost all actors doing it are on short cycles of 8 weeks, medically supervised so most probably on testosterone only. Smokes and mirrors does the rest. Any BB would put them to shame if they stand next to them. Their PED usage is very light by BB standards.
The Rock or Arnold at his prime are obviously not on T only. Arnold was asked to downsize for his role in Conan. He was deemed too freakish.
I dont totally agree. The recent years male actors grew bigger, for example henry cavill in man of steel. Of course nothing compared with a fbb if you look percentage wise from where they started but still I presume they re getting on heavier stuff nowadays. It's always impressive to see how big women can grow with ped's when you compare to men. And the last years have been crazy in terms of size and weight
No engineering is being done these days. The anabolic steroid technology has stopped back in the 80s. Big pharma stopped researching and producing new compounds. Politics, banning and the abuse from the sports community were the main reasons.
That's not entirely true. In the crossfit world, a few athletes have been busted recently by testing positive for an agonist called GW501516, or better known on the black market as Endurobol. The discovery of the compound was published in 2001, and in 2007 it was reported that use of the compound resulted in increased athletic performance, leading to WADA banning it in 2009.
That's not entirely true. In the crossfit world, a few athletes have been busted recently by testing positive for an agonist called GW501516, or better known on the black market as Endurobol. The discovery of the compound was published in 2001, and in 2007 it was reported that use of the compound resulted in increased athletic performance, leading to WADA banning it in 2009.
I look it up. I haven't heard it before. It is a SARM not an anabolic steroid. I have not really studied SARMS. It helps glucose uptake and fat oxidation. There are dozens of SARMs, long term safety still unknown, a couple of them are proven carcinogenic, and guess what, people still use them.
For the time being you can buy them semi-legally but it is a matter of time to get them banned like prohormones many years ago.
I dont totally agree. The recent years male actors grew bigger, for example henry cavill in man of steel. Of course nothing compared with a fbb if you look percentage wise from where they started but still I presume they re getting on heavier stuff nowadays. It's always impressive to see how big women can grow with ped's when you compare to men. And the last years have been crazy in terms of size and weight
For sure! I don't follow Hollywood much. Actors aren't the brightest people, I would go the medical route and get a doctor and Test but I have no doubt for the huge paychecks no one would think twice to call the gym dealer for black market gear. Mark Wallberg uses heavy compounds for years, Stallone is juiced. Drugs of all kinds are common in Hollywood.
Contrary to current belief, considerable research is being done to develop non-steroidal anabolic agents. There are a few universities and biotech companies working on this. The research is targeting the natural myostatin pathways. Myostatin is a natural muscle growth suppressant. However, direct inhibition of myostatin leads to other side effects, the pathway is complex. A current unmet medical need for these meds is muscle wasting or cachexia. Unfortunately, you most likely wouldn’t get supported if you requested funding for research to build muscle for aesthetic or athletic reasons.
There are rumors that doctors in Dubai are offering these types of procedures that affect myostatin.
For sure! I don't follow Hollywood much. Actors aren't the brightest people, I would go the medical route and get a doctor and Test but I have no doubt for the huge paychecks no one would think twice to call the gym dealer for black market gear. Mark Wallberg uses heavy compounds for years, Stallone is juiced. Drugs of all kinds are common in Hollywood.
And they have other addictions too!
GW501516 is not a SARM. It is an experimental drug in the class of PPAR agonists. This class of drugs deals with insulin resistance, cholesterol levels and cell development. GW5# was being developed as a cholesterol lowering drug but had side effects in clinical trials so research was discontinued. Being metabolic regulators, this class of drugs may help a person loose weight and get lean. But there is no direct effect on muscle like anabolic steroids or myostatin inhibitors. Based on what I read about GW#, it would not be smart to experiment on yourself with this drug.
What PEDs are the top FBBs taking? For example, what does Eun Agee Kang take? She’s huge and looks amazing. Would the same compounds work for a male? How do some keep their hair full and others don’t?
At that a level and in the bodybuilding division: pretty much all of them. Though something to keep in mind: at the end of day, genetics are what determines how successful you are in bodybuilding at the pro level. They determine how you are built and how you respond to training and drugs.
Hair loss is, again, determined by genetics. Assuming a bodybuilder is running a pretty extensive stack of harsh compounds, a side effect is that they accelerate hair loss if you are genetically prone to it. If you aren’t susceptible to hair loss, you probably won’t lose much of your hairline, if at all.
So where do you all get your information from? Is there a specific go-to website that covers this?
It depends on why you need the info. For info on steroids and experimental drugs that may be used to build muscle, you need to go to real scientific sources. There you’ll find factual reports on side effects, risks and effectiveness.
A lot of ad hoc and anecdotal information exists on the web. I wouldn’t totally discount trial and error accounts but you won’t get the whole story in most cases. I did hear about a couple of books that summarized both the scientific/medical info as well as the anecdotal experiences but need to find the titles.
It depends on why you need the info. For info on steroids and experimental drugs that may be used to build muscle, you need to go to real scientific sources. There you’ll find factual reports on side effects, risks and effectiveness.
A lot of ad hoc and anecdotal information exists on the web. I wouldn’t totally discount trial and error accounts but you won’t get the whole story in most cases. I did hear about a couple of books that summarized both the scientific/medical info as well as the anecdotal experiences but need to find the titles.
Anabolics by William Llewelyn is one of those books.
It depends on why you need the info. For info on steroids and experimental drugs that may be used to build muscle, you need to go to real scientific sources. There you’ll find factual reports on side effects, risks and effectiveness.
A lot of ad hoc and anecdotal information exists on the web. I wouldn’t totally discount trial and error accounts but you won’t get the whole story in most cases. I did hear about a couple of books that summarized both the scientific/medical info as well as the anecdotal experiences but need to find the titles.
or you take a shortcut and hire a coach.
you think bodybuilders are reading old books and doing experiments? hell no... they just hire someone to tell them exactly what to do ..... which is the same drugs/diet/training bodybuilders have been doing forever.
Is it true that PEDs cause fbbs' hands to grow in size? I've notice these ladies' hands look bigger than normal women's hands and not gonna lie find it pretty attractive. So I'm curious if that is caused by PED use?
or you take a shortcut and hire a coach.
you think bodybuilders are reading old books and doing experiments? hell no... they just hire someone to tell them exactly what to do ..... which is the same drugs/diet/training bodybuilders have been doing forever.
The issue I have with that is how would you know you're getting good, reliable information? It's an honest question. I guess personally I wouldn't be as quick to trust a 25 year old who's been pumping everything into his/her body indiscriminately for only a few years, vs. someone who has been taking PED's for 25+ years and still seems to be healthy. But outside of that, I wouldn't really know a credible source just by looking at them, and they could pretty much tell someone like me (again since I only possess an average level of knowledge of this topic at best) anything and make it sound like they know what they're talking about.
Not to mention, there are coaches (one in particular comes to mind) who really push their athletes to the brink of death, and in some cases they actually have died.
Also, my original intent for this thread was to find more scientific data, and so that's where my preference for written articles comes from. I know anyone could tell me to "Google it," but this thread is a way to cut through the BS that a Google search would give us (ads and commentary articles, rather than anything scientific). I'm not asking anyone to do the work for me, I'm just asking if anyone has already read through an enlightening article and recalls the title of it, or has perhaps bookmarked it.
The scientific information on steroidal and non steroidal anabolic agents as well as past and current research in the area may be found on PubMed. You can download this search engine run by NIH and search for information based on key words or phrases. Your search should turn up lists of scientific references and sometimes into the hundreds or even thousands (if broad search words). You are free to read introductory abstracts which should summarize research and conclusions in one or two paragraphs. Many full length articles are not available for free unless you work for a university, hospital or in a health related company. Educating oneself is the only way to stay informed rather than relying on someone else’s “experience “.
edited title to make it more compact
I know just as much or maybe slightly more than the average person. I am by no means an expert on this. I'm just creating this thread so that those who are interested can discuss PED's (Performance Enhancing Drugs, which includes steroids). Ask questions, share articles, and if you are a qualified expert/doctor then please enlighten us. If you have knowledge from personal experience, then please feel welcome to share.
I mention "engineering" in the title because I know they're always looking for ways to tweak existing or create new kinds of PED's. One thing I've always wondered is why it's seemingly so difficult to engineer a drug that targets the muscles without affecting hormone levels. Why is it that muscle growth is so dependent upon having a high level of testosterone? Or perhaps such drugs are possible already, but a low demand is keeping them from pursuing it?